SITREP Pod 2: Free Nahid Taghavi, German hostage in Iran | Pod Hostage Diplomacy

SITREP Pod 2: Free Nahid Taghavi, German hostage in Iran

SPEAKERS

Mariam Claren, Daren Nair

Daren Nair  00:05

Welcome to Pod Hostage Diplomacy. We work to free hostages and the unjustly detained around the world. Together with their families, we share their stories and let you know how you can help bring them home.

Elizabeth Whelan  00:18

Now when it comes to using the family to get... for Russia to get what they want, if that's the case, they've picked the wrong family, because I'm not going to carry water for the Russian authorities.

Daren Nair  00:28

These are some of the most courageous and resilient people among us.

Mariam Claren  00:32

I never thought that my mother, Nahid Taghavi, will ever have a link to negotiations in Vienna about the JCPOA. That's so crazy.

Daren Nair  00:43

People who have never given up hope.

Paula Reed  00:46

Trevor told his girlfriend to tell me to... to be strong. So, I'm trying to be strong for Trevor.

Joey Reed  00:50

You know, if Trevor can cope with what he's dealing with...

Paula Reed  00:53

Exactly.

Joey Reed  00:53

We can sure cope with the stress.

Daren Nair  00:55

People who will never stop working to reunite the families.

Joey Reed  01:00

We'd like to meet with the President. We believe that, you know, he has... he's surrounded by lots of experienced and educated advisors. But I don't believe that any of them have ever had a child taken hostage by a foreign country, especially not a superpower like Russia.

Daren Nair  01:15

And we will be right there by their side until their loved one comes back home.

Richard Ratcliffe  01:20

Because if enough people care, then the right people will care enough.

Daren Nair  01:24

I'm Daren Nair, and I've been campaigning with many of these families for years. When I first started campaigning with these families, I noticed they struggle to get the media attention they needed. So, I decided to create this podcast, which is a safe space for the families to speak as long as they need to about their loved ones, and what needs to be done to bring them home.

Mariam Claren  01:45

Nobody can prepare you for what our family is going through. Even if someone had told me one year before, "in one years, this is going to happen. Prepare yourself." That's impossible.

Daren Nair  01:59

Thank you for listening, and welcome to Pod Hostage Diplomacy. Welcome to Pod Hostage Diplomacy. On 16th October 2020, German citizen, Nahid Taghavi, who was 66 years old at the time, went out for a walk near her apartment in Tehran. It was a week after she had surgery, and Nahid had high blood pressure. Within moments, she was surrounded by 12 armed men from the Iranian Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, also known as the IRGC. She was arrested and taken to the notorious Evin Prison, where she is still being detained today. The United Nations Working Group on Arbitrary Detention has stated that Nahid's detention is arbitrary, meaning she is wrongfully imprisoned, and they have called for her immediate release. Amnesty International has stated that Nahid is a prisoner of conscience and has called for her immediate and unconditional release as well. Members of the German Bundestag, from multiple political parties, have stated that Nahid is unjustly detained and have called for her release. There are many foreign nationals from Western countries currently wrongfully imprisoned in Iran. The Iranian regime is notorious for using these innocent foreign nationals as bargaining chips to extract concessions from their home country. This is state-sponsored hostage-taking, also known as hostage diplomacy. We've had the honour of interviewing Nahid's daughter, Marian Claren, twice on this podcast. You can listen to these episodes wherever you get your podcasts, or on our website podhostagediplomacy.com. We tell all the hostage families that we'll be campaigning right by their side until their loved ones come back home. And we mean it. So, we'll keep you up to date on their cases, using sitrep pods like this one, or breaking news pods. Today, we're joined once again by Mariam Claren. Mariam, I know a lot has happened in Iran since we last spoke, almost a year ago. We're so sorry you're still going through this nightmare. Thank you for taking the time to speak to us again.

Mariam Claren  04:11

Thank you, Daren, for having me again on your show.

Daren Nair  04:13

You're welcome. So, you've been able to get a lot of media coverage on your mother's detention in Iran, which is great. But just in case some of our listeners are not aware of your mother's case, can you please give them an overview of what happened?

Mariam Claren  04:28

Sure. As you mentioned in the intro, my mother, Nahid Taghavi, is a German-Iranian dual national, and she travelled between Iran and Germany since years, and in October 2020, she was arrested by the notorious IRGC and brought to Evin Prison. We did not have any news of her for weeks. She spent seven months in solitary confinement without legal counsel, and she was interrogated by the agents of the IRGC, more than 1,000 hours, and then she was sentenced in a short trial, and a sham trial, in summer 2021 to ten years and eight months in prison, on the trumped up charges running an illegal group to disrupt national security and propaganda against the state.

Daren Nair  05:24

I'm sorry to hear that. So, since we last spoke in March last year, many things have happened in Iran, some of them good, but certainly most of them bad. Can you tell us more about these events?

Mariam Claren  05:38

Yes, sure. As you mentioned, a lot happened the last month in Iran. In our personal case, we were campaigning and trying to get my mother on a medical furlough since her health was deteriorating in prison, and we finally succeed in Summer 2022. And on... in July 2022, after really a huge campaign and outcry on international level, she was granted medical furlough and could leave prison for the first time after almost two years. And she started her medical treatment outside prison. She was with the family, and out of the blue, in the middle of the medical treatment, the Prosecutor's Office called her in November 2022, and said that they think her medical treatment is finished, and she should come back to prison. Although a lot of doctors had confirmed that she is not in a condition and position to go back in prison, but they forced her to come back. And the whole situation in Iran is related to the case of my mother. As you mentioned, a lot of things happened in Iran. In September 2022, we all heard that the Kurdish woman, Jina Mahsa Amini, died in police custody. And after her murder, after her death, there was an international outcry. But also the people in Iran started the first woman-led revolution with the slogan, "Woman, Life, Freedom" and start the uprising, the protest... protests started. And also the Iranian diaspora and the international community showed their solidarity with the Iranian people. There are almost, every week, protests and vigils around the world. And it was very funny, because I think it was one hour after the German Chancellor first spoke out about the protests and how the Iranian regime is brutally doing a crackdown on the protests. He spoke in a video to the Iranian government. And he said, "what kind of government are you that you're killing your own people in the streets?" And exactly 45 minutes later, the call from the Prosecutor's Office came and they told my mother to come back to prison. So, this shows that every action by the German government is related to the case of my mother. I want to mention that I completely agree with the reaction of our Chancellor, and I also stand in solidarity by the people of Iran, and it's good that the Western governments show actions, but in our case always, actions means that something could happen to my mother.

Daren Nair  08:52

Again, I'm sorry to hear that. And you're right. If it happens 45 minutes after the German Chancellor makes a statement then, clearly, it's related to using your mother as a pawn, a bargaining chip. So, I understand that your mum is now the only known dual national still held in Evin Prison, the only female dual national still held in Evin prison, because this... and this is because the French academic, Fariba Adelkhah, who was wrongfully imprisoned in Iran since 5th of June 2019, was recently released from Evin Prison. But the circumstances of her release are still not clear as we don't know if she can leave Iran and go back to France to be reunited with her loved ones. Your mum and Fariba were quite close. Now, your mum's the only, again as I said, the only female dual national hostage left in Evin. Do you want to just talk more about that and how's... How's your mum doing? When was the last time you spoke to her etc.?

Mariam Claren  09:55

We were very happy when we heard the news that Fariba Adelkhah is finally... finally released from Evin Prison. But that was also the point when I realised, okay, your mom is the last female political prisoner, dual national political prisoner, in the Woman Ward of Evin Prison. As you mentioned, maybe there are more in Iranian prisons, and we don't know about their cases. We know that there is Cecile Kohler, the female, French citizen, teacher. She's also in Evin Prison, but she is unfortunately still in the Isolation Section, 209. So, in the Women Ward of Evin Prison, my mother is the only dual national, and Fariba was released after there was a so-called amnesty by the Supreme Leader. So, after the protests about Jina Mahsa Amini, and the... they started arresting more than 20,000 people during the protests. There was so much international out... outcry that they started in January, doing this amnesty thing to show a soft side and say, "we are not that bad as you think," only... also for the people in Iran, but also for the foreign governments to show, "we are doing some good things." And there was some conditions in this amnesty rule. You have to be more than 60 years old. You have to... You are not allowed to be charged with espionage and some other things. So, it was again very funny, because under the rule of the amnesty, my mother should have got the amnesty, the pardon, too, because she's over 16, er 60. Of course she's over 16. She's over 60, and she was not charged with espionage. And after our lawyers talked to the prosecutor and the judiciary and said, "okay, Nahid Taghavi should get the amnesty, too, the first time, they even did not hide why they have arrested her, because the prosecutor said to our lawyer, "she's not included; she's a dual national." On the one hand, they do not recognise dual national citizenship. So, no dual national citizen who is imprisoned get consular access. They say, "you are an Iranian prisoner; you are an Iranian citizen." And on the other hand, that's the reason why they arrest them, and they use them as pawns. But it was really shocking to me that they did not hide it anymore. And they clearly told our lawyer, "she's not included. She's a German citizen." Although Fariba Adelkhah is also a French citizen... citizen. So, she was included. So, I think there was a deal between France and Iran and they hide it under the... under the amnesty rule. Again, I'm so happy Fariba and other prisoners could get released. There were 61 women prisoners in the women wing and now 26 are left. So, all the others have been released, which is a very good thing. But, as we see, if my mom would not be German citizen... citizen, she would be free now, too. And the last time I spoke to her was this morning. The women in Evin Prison are allowed to call their families five times in the week. And it started always with Saturday until Wednesday. So, we talked this morning together. And she is really mentally in a good situation like always. She was always very, very strong. And she knows that regime very good. And she also know the international political situation very good. But what is really concerning is her health condition. As I mentioned, her treatment was not over. She has high blood pressure. She told me today that yesterday she was feeling so bad, and her blood pressure was so high, so the doctor came into the ward. So, the med... health situation, the physical situation is really, really concerning. But I'm happy that her mental health is always very good.

Daren Nair  14:35

Well, I'm... I'm relieved that her mental health is good, and her physical health isn't too bad. Now, during these nationwide protests, this ongoing revolution, more foreign nationals have been arrested. Some of them are in Evin Prison. Some of them are held in prisons in Mahshad. Have they taken any more German citizens to the best of your knowledge?

Mariam Claren  14:59

We don't know. Some requests of the German media to the Foreign Ministry, they were told there are more German citizens. And we assume that there are in total seven German citizens, which includes my mother and Jamshid, Sharmahd and five other German citizens, but I have no clue who they are, if they are dual nationals, where they are. I even did some postings on my social media accounts and asked the families to get in contact with me, so I can help them campaigning, but I assume that the German Foreign Ministry has told them to stay quiet, and that they are going to solve this in quiet diplomacy. And this is so wrong. And I feel so bad for these families, because I know that the day will come when they will realise that silent diplomacy is not going to work. And they will regret that they did not go public with the case. But I'm here for them. If they want to go public with the case, they can contact me anytime, and I will help them.

Daren Nair  16:12

So, on that point of keeping quiet, I understand your perspective. According to most of the families I've interviewed, if they could go back in time, they would go public straight away. But there are Italians and New Zealand citizens and Polish citizens, who have been released within months. And they kept quiet. So Alessia Piperno, the Italian tourist, she was released within a couple of months. The New Zealand couple, they were released, again within a few months. And Polish scientist, can't pronounce his name, but he was released again, I believe, within five, six months. And they've agreed with the government's quiet diplomacy approach. And it does work for some people. It varies depending on country and the amount of leverage that country has over Iran. But what are your thoughts?

Mariam Claren  17:09

Of course, I also realise that the Italian woman, the New Zealand couple, and the Polish scientist were released, and the cases were not much public. And I don't know any case of a dual national where the case has been solved within months without going public. So, the dual national thing is something else than only being a foreign national. And I also think that in the case, for example, from the Italian woman who was in prison, they solve it very quickly. But I think when you get some signs from the prisoner, if you see they're charging the person with espionage, or in my mother's case running an illegal group, if these families have been gone public, the... the three people... the four people you mentioned, would also be free. So, going public never harmed the case. Maybe there are some... some cases, as you said, these three cases where have been solved very quickly. But how many cases, do we know? Daren, yourself, campaigned since years on this issue. How many cases do we know that they have been solved so quickly? So, I think going public is always the better solution, the better way to go.

Daren Nair  18:42

In your case, I completely understand. And I know I contacted you the same day you went public. But I think, also based on the people I've interviewed, there are differing interests. So, the government has their objectives, and the family, they have their own objectives. And they are not necessarily the same. So, for the family, they can't... they want their loved one home as soon as possible. And while they're in captivity, they want their loved one to be taken care of well, as well as they can be, basically, whereas the government, they want to free the citizen. But at the same time, they don't want to incentivise more of their citizens being taken. And they also don't want to pay too much, or a high price to free that citizen, because they are a hostage. And if you want to free your hostage, you have to give up a concession. So, they are trying to keep the price of the hostage as low as possible, because they're the ones who are going to have to pay up, and I think the reason why governments tell families to keep quiet is because the louder you are, the more public your case is, the bigger the concession the government will have to give up to free your loved one. So, you... an example would be Russia. I... there... Brittney Griner, the WNBA basketball player, She's world-famous. She's an Olympic gold medalist. She's a celebrity, and the United States freed her in a prisoner swap for Viktor Bout, who is called the Merchant of Death, who is a global arms dealer and there have been other Americans, less famous, held in Russia. And it was unlikely they would have been freed in a one-to-one prisoner swap with a Russian who was that famous. And my point is, the reason governments tell families to keep quiet is they want to keep the price of the hostage down. And obviously, from your perspective, the more media coverage you get, the safer your mum is in Evin Prison, right, because they can't hurt her. They have to give her her medication. They can't abuse her. So, that's where your interest and the interest of the German government differ. So, you've been doing this for over two years now, almost three years, two and a half years. Have you had these problems with the German government, where they tell you to keep quiet, but you insist on going public?

Mariam Claren  21:27

Of course, the German government told me in the very first beginning, after my mother was arrested, that I should not go public with the case. And they tried to solve the situation behind closed doors. And I told them, If you tell me, my mom will be on a plane in 48 hours, I'm going to stay silent. But if not, it's not possible for me to stay silent, because the reasons are, as you said, it's not... Media is not only for making the case public, and putting pressure on our government, of course, it's also a reason. But on the other hand, you protect the prisoner... prisoner, who is known, whose name is in media will get medical attention. They are not going to harm the person physically. And they know that this person has a lot of supporters. I always quote the judge of my mother, Iman Afshari, from the Revolutionary Court 26, when my mother entered the courtroom in April 2021, and they brought her from solitary confinement to the courtroom, where she met her lawyer for the first time, the judge looked at her and said, "oh, there is my famous prisoner. The German Embassy is in my court. People around the world are demanding your freedom." And I think that was one of the most biggest compliments, which we could get, because he realised that this is not Person Number 123. This is someone people care about. So, you protect, on the one hand, the prisoner, and on the other hand, I think without going public, and without media coverage, and NGO activism etc., I don't know how much the German government would do if there was not so much pressure on them. Because at the end, the governments all act in their own interests, and own business interests, and political interests. And maybe a case like Nahid Taghavi, who is even not original German, is for them, maybe they are not going to do as much as they can if there is not so much pressure on them. And I know that there is a lot of pressure on the German government because of my mother's case, because she's since more than two and a half years, almost two and a half years in media. So, people complain and this is something which is important.

Daren Nair  24:05

You're absolutely right, and I... I've been campaigning with families like yours for seven years now. And I note that the British government didn't send their representatives to the court when the British-Iranian dual nationals were being tried, well being tried would be incorrect or inaccurate, because it's a sham trial. But, at least, the German representatives were able to go to your mother's trial. Now, last week, German citizen and US resident, Jamshid Sharmahd, who has been held hostage in Iran since July 2020, was sentenced to death, and he may be executed at any moment. We've interviewed Jamshid's daughter, Gazelle Sharmahd, twice on this podcast, most recently, three weeks ago, or four weeks ago, and we know you've been campaigning closely with her, as your loved ones are both German citizens. Can you just tell us more about this?

Mariam Claren  25:07

Yes, of course. As you said, and people can hear the episodes with Gazelle Sharmahd on your podcast, if they like. Her father, Jamshid Sharmahd, was kidnapped in Dubai in July 2020 by the intelligence agents of the Islamic Republic and brought to Iran. They broadcast a forced confession from him, and since then, he's been held at an unknown location. And he has very, very rarely contact with his family. He's allowed to maybe phone them once or two times in the year. And last February, he was charged with Corruption on Earth. And last Tuesday, they announced his sentence, which is the death sentence. And this is something Gazelle is telling the world since more than two years that they want to kill his father. And last Tuesday, the sentence finally came. And it was a very bad day, because Gazelle was sleeping. She lives in California. So, it was in the middle of the night in California. And it was noon in... in Germany when I saw the announcement by the judiciary... judiciary of the Iranian government. And, of course, every media started covering this sentence. So, I tried to reach Gazelle, because I didn't want her to wake up and see this news through Twitter. And I could finally reach her at around 5am, her morning. And I had to told her that her father got... her father got the death sentence, and it was a very, very difficult talk, because we are... we were both crying and... But we started immediately an emergency campaign in Germany, and the political sponsor of her dad, who is the chief of the Christian Democrat Party was in California, fortunately, and visited her, and there is a big campaign under the hashtag #SaveSharmahd, going on. The German government showed for the first time a reaction. First, our Foreign Minister, Annalena Baerbock, tweeted about the sentence the other day. Our Chancellor, Olaf Scholz, tweeted about the sentence, and the first action they took, they expelled two diplomats of the Iranian Embassy in Germany, two persons non grata, I don't know the English wording. So, they had to leave Iran immediately. And right now, we are in limbo to be... to be honest, and we don't know what is going to happen with Jamshid Sharmahd. If you want to see it legally, there has to be an appeal, but we are talking about the Islamic Republic of Iran. You never know what they do. And they, they took so much on them to kidnap him from Dubai, bring him into Iran. He's at an unknown location. He has no contact with nobody. And now he's facing the death penalty. So, it is a very, very dangerous situation, and I really hope that the German government will do more actions and not only expelling two employees of the Islamic Republic Embassy.

Daren Nair  28:57

Yeah. So, I've been raising awareness of this death sentence as well, and the fact that action needs to be taken, not just words, but actions need to be taken. And it was good to see the German government publicly mentioned Jamshid Shamahd's name, I don't think they've ever publicly mentioned your mother's name, have they?

Mariam Claren  29:16

Once. After the sentence of my mother was given, they also did a statement, well, "we have deeply condemned the... the sentence." I have to laugh, because it's always the same wordings, "we demand immediate release," or "we demand to squash the sentence," you know. These are just wordings which are written... written by the assistants of the offices of the... of the person. So, this was the first time that we see really an action by the German government. I don't want to say they... that they do not do nothing. You mentioned the UK Government, and if we want to compare these two governments, I think the German government, as you said, they went to the court of my mother. And they also negotiate the medical furlough of my mother. But I don't want to give them the props, because to be honest, there was so much pressure on them. There was the case was so public, and we campaigned so long. So, they had to do something. But it was their negotiation that my mother was sent on a medical furlough, because as we know, the Iranian government will never allow a dual national anything if there is no negotiation with the western country. So, I... I really hope that it's not only mentioning Jamshid's case, not only the actions expelling two persons, but we have no clue what is going to happen in the next days or weeks.

Daren Nair  30:49

Yeah. So, on the British government, I'm not saying they didn't do anything. They did give Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe diplomatic protection, and they did help negotiate her house arrest. She didn't spend... I mean, she was out of Evin Prison for at least one or two years as a result of the COVID pandemic. And yeah, she wasn't the only prisoner who they helped. But my point is, yes. it's not they... they didn't do anything; they can definitely do a lot more. Now, just before we move on to what should the Iranian regime do, what should the German government do, etc., I also noticed that the French government also made a statement standing in solidarity with Jamshid Sharmahd, and in the last 24 hours, the US Special Envoy for Iran, Robert Malley, he also posted a statement condemning this death sentence, but he didn't really acknowledge Jamshid as a US resident. He mentioned... he stated that Jamshid is a German-Iranian dual national, didn't mention that Jamshid's American, even though he's lived in the United States for almost two decades. Most of his family, if not all of his family in the US, are American citizens, including Gazelle, which was surprising. Do you have any thoughts on that?

Mariam Claren  32:07

I also saw that the French government did a tweet, and that Robert Malley did a tweet. You know, I don't want to sound frustrated, but I don't know what to do with such tweets, you know. I can tweet everything, anytime, as you said, they even did not recognise Jamshid as a US citizen, although he lives there since two decades, as you say. It's good to see that they realise the case. It's good to see that they condemned the sentence. But I really hope that they work in the background together, the German government, the French government, the US government, whoever, to solve this problems. But as I always say, I think they only will do something if they have much press... pressure from ordinary people, and that the public opinion is aware of this situation and demands the governments to do something.

Daren Nair  33:14

So, what should the Iranian regime do? 

Mariam Claren  33:17

Go away. I think the Iranian regime is done. Really, you know, people in the street are chanting, "Death to the Dictator. We don't want the Islamic Republic of Iran anymore," since more than almost six months. But as long as they are there and not going away, I have no demands to the German... to the Iranian government, to be honest, because to me, this is a terrorist state, who is taking hostages, who is doing so much human rights abuses, who is raping my sisters in... in prison, who is killing my brothers on the streets, and I have no demands to the Iranian government.

Daren Nair  34:05

What should the German government do?

Mariam Claren  34:07

I have a lot of demands to the German government. First of all, I think the German government should finally realise that their Iran politics that they are doing since 44 years does not work, that Iran is not a normal country or a normal government, who you can negotiate with, who you can do business with. So, as I always say, they should hear the voice of the diaspora. They should put maximal pressure on the regime. And I want to mention, I don't mean pressure, like any military intervention, or putting sanctions which will hurt the people, but I think there are a lot of other things they can do, such as listing the IRGC on the terrorist list and such as putting individual sanctions on persons who are included in the human rights abuses, and so on, you know. I'm not a politician, and I have my profession in my job. And if someone to my customers come to me and say, we want this and that, they don't have to tell me how I can solve their problem. They tell me what the problem is, and I know how to solve the problem. And this is the same about the German government. They need to solve the case of Jamshid Sharmahd and Nahid Taghavi, however they do that, and I'm sure they know how to do that. But Gazelle said something very good the other day to me. She said, "my dad is bleeding, and they are only looking at him and giving him some... something to... to stop the bleed, but they are not... they are not doing something against why he is bleeding, you know." And this was a very nice, I thought, thing she used, because she's a nurse, and she said, "when I... I have to have a patient and want to do something about it, I know what to do." So, the German government, I think, knows what to do. It... I think it is very important that they work together on a European level because, as you said, we have, I think, seven or six, since Fariba is out of prison. There are six French citizens. We have at least three Austrian citizens. Two names are known; one is not known. We have two Swedish cases. So, there are a lot of cases, the German cases. There are a lot of cases in... within the European Union. So, I think they should work closely. We have the Belgium case. Sorry, I forgot the... the... the Belgian case. So, I think there is a lot they can do to work together, and they should do this immediately.

Daren Nair  37:06

Yes, the Belgian citizen is Olivier Vandecasteele. What should the international community do?

Mariam Claren  37:15

Since the death of Jina Mahsa Amini in police custody, I think the whole world have witnessed what the Iranian regime is. Not only our parents, are hostages in prisons, I can say that 80 million people are hostages, are prisoners of a brutal fascist regime. So, I really ask the international community to stand with the Iranian people, to follow the cases of our parents, #SaveSharmahd, #FreeNahid. You can find us on social media. Everybody can help. It's a Like. You can share our postings. You can talk with your friends about this. Go to protests in your cities. There are always protests about the Woman Life Freedom revolution in Iran. Take the pictures of our parents with you. Raise awareness about what is going on, because it's very, very important. Right now, there is a golden time, because the whole world is watching Iran. And we think that this is the time that could save the lives of our loved ones. And we don't know what in six months is going to happen. But I really ask the international community to stay by our side.

Daren Nair  38:40

What can journalists and news outlets do to help because, as we discussed earlier, media attention literally saves the lives of these hostages. It makes sure that they are protected. They are given medical attention where necessary. So, what else can journalists and news outlets do to help? 

Mariam Claren  39:04

As you said, we need as lot as media coverage as possible. The names of our parents need to be in media as much as it's possible to, first of all, protect them and second, put pressure on the German government to do something about the cases. And the only thing that helps is media coverage. And I know there's a lot of things going on in the world, and you you do a great job, but please do not forget this individual cases. Right, so much other things are going on, we need your help. We don't have that much followers or that much people that... that hear our voices, and we do 24/7 campaigning on social media, going on the streets, but we really need the media to echo our voices and to put awareness on our cases. So, I really ask you to... do not stop covering...  Gazelle Sharmahd get... got a lot of media attention the last three, four days. But she's so afraid, she told me yesterday, "maybe in two or three days, they're not going to cover the story of my dad anymore. And then the regime is going to kill him, while... while nobody is watching." And I ask you, in the name of Gazelle Sharmahd, please do cover her case again and again. 

Daren Nair  40:29

What can members of the public do to help?

Mariam Claren  40:32

As I said, I think it's very important to put this problem into the mind of the public opinion. And I know, as I said about the media, there's so much going on. We're in the middle of a war in Europe, and so on. But I think, don't look away. I know it's sometimes difficult, and we are tired, too. I'm tired after two and a half years. I do not have a normal life since two and a half years. And I know that sometimes you get tired. It's okay to be tired, and maybe do not do anything. But when you are not tired anymore, please use your positive energy and support us. As I said, you can always see where protests in your city. There are almost every Saturday in the big cities worldwide, protests for Iran. Go there, take the pictures of the prisoners with you. Tell your friends about what is going on. Write your MPs. This is the easiest thing you can do. Write an email to your MP. And it... it does not matter in which country you live. Write an email and tell them to put pressure on the government to work with the German government. The more people know about our fate, the more people will get aware and can help us.

Daren Nair  41:58

Well said. Mariam, we're almost at the end of our interview. Is there anything else you'd like to mention?

Mariam Claren  42:04

I think we talked about everything which happened in Iran, and Nahid's and Jamshid's case. And, again, I want to thank you that you have this show, and you give us families the opportunity to talk about our... about our parents and our loved ones, unjustly detained abroad. So, thank you very much, Daren, for doing this.

Daren Nair  42:26

You're very welcome. It's an honour to help. Mariam, we'll be campaigning right by your side until your mother's free and comes back home to Cologne in Germany. Thank you for taking the time to speak to us today. 

Mariam Claren  42:38

Thank you.

Daren Nair  42:44

Thank you for listening to Pod Hostage Diplomacy. Thank you for giving your time and for showing these families that they're not alone, that there are good, caring people out there, willing to stand by their side and help in any way possible.

Richard Ratcliffe  42:58

Because if enough people care, then the right people will care enough. This is a basic rule of thumb that is true for all campaigning.

Daren Nair  43:07

If you haven't already, please subscribe to our fortnightly newsletter called The Hostage Briefing. It's the best way to keep up to date with the cases we're working on as well as new episodes. You can subscribe to this newsletter using the link in the description of this podcast episode that you're currently listening to. Thanks again and take care.